Nah, it’s a known cultural fact that tipped wages are offloaded directly onto the consumer. Not paying them is refusing to participate in the game of capitalism in the worst possible way. By withholding the wages of your fellow worker but continuing to do business with their employer, you are just increasing the value extracted from them.
If you don’t want to tip, don’t go to tipped restaurants.
That’s it. That’s the only ethical play to avoid tipping. Don’t participate at all, don’t fund the unethical business model at all. As it stands, not tipping doesn’t threaten the business model - they still get paid.
Lol, I’m sure your reasoning is really going to make a difference to the person depending on tips to make rent. And I’m sure the owner is just going to feel terrible that his server didn’t get compensated.
Maybe you should just avoid giving your business to restaurants that exploit the tip based system? You aren’t ending tipping culture by not tipping, you’re just taking advantage of workers just as much as the owners.
They may have more time or availability for someone who does tip, plus they aren’t wasting their labour on someone.
Oh, wow. Suddenly they’re not being paid at all only because one person doesn’t tip? How does that work?
Yeah, but I never claimed I was attempting to end tipping culture by wasting people’s time and effort.
Not tipping wastes nobody’s time. That’s not how time works. You did say “You aren’t ending tipping culture by not tipping, you’re just taking advantage of workers just as much as the owners” which I turned around on you, though. Also, what you said here is wrong because I don’t exploit anybody’s labour by not tipping since I’m not getting paid to eat out. You understand that.
Again, why not just support businesses that don’t rely on tipping to pay their staff?
Why didn’t I think of that and not do it for the last 20 years? You really opened my eyes to the most obvious thing ever! I already don’t perpetuate a system that exploits workers. Maybe you should too.
Oh, wow. Suddenly they’re not being paid at all only because one person doesn’t tip? How does that work?
Lol, I’m guessing you’ve never worked in a restaurant before? If you are taking one of their tables and they are having to serve you, and you don’t tip…they don’t get money for that table and whatever time you used it for. If you hadn’t taken up the table, they may have gotten a customer who wasn’t an asshole.
Not tipping wastes nobody’s time
It wastes the servers time, but you don’t seem to think that matters.
which I turned around on you, though.
How, by being wrong?
I don’t exploit anybody’s labour by not tipping since I’m not getting paid to eat out. You understand that.
Tipping is wrong because it turns over the responsibility of labour expense to the customer. You, the customer are denying that labour expense and leaving the labourer unpaid for their labour. Meaning you are participating and taking advantage of their labour.
Why didn’t I think of that and not do it for the last 20 years?
Lol, you are still participating in the tip culture if you give your business to places that rely on tipping, but don’t tip. The owner still gets paid and doesn’t give a shit if the server does or not.
And if you are saying you don’t go to places that accept tips, then why are you even fucking talking to me? My whole point was that people who don’t like tipping culture shouldn’t go to places that accept tips.
I know how tipping works, thank you. If I’m not being tipped for waiting a table, I still get paid hourly wages, meaning I get money for that table or any other I wait during my work hours. If I hadn’t taken that table, I would still make hourly wages. I can’t believe you don’t know that. You’re not just acting obtuse, are you?
Not tipping wastes nobody’s time. Servers are paid by the hour. Hours are time. Servers do not get to leave earlier when they receive tips. Do you think restaurant owners waste servers’ time by underpaying them? Be honest.
You know what turning something around on someone means. If you’re unsure what happened, please make use of the scrolling up technology and use your eyes and brain to read what it says there. You already agreed that tipping doesn’t end tipping culture, so your act doesn’t really make sense now.
I don’t employ servers, so it is in no way my responsibility to pay their wages. I’m responsible for paying for the food and service that I receive. The owner is responsible to pay for the labour they receive. Rather simple in concept, really. It’s fine if you’re OK with picking up someone’s employer’s tab, I won’t. Just don’t confuse who’s exploiting who just because you so desperately want to shift the blame away from the restaurant owner. Why are you even doing that? You’re in a situation where one guy says “hey, you’re going to work for me full time but I’m only paying you a fraction even though I receive the full labour. If you’re lucky, my customers donate some of their money to your living expenses. Most do, the others are huge assholes, right?” and you go “right, that’s very fair and sensible. Thank you so much for this opportunity, Mr Moneybags! Oh, the system surely sucks but apart from shaming customers into shelling out for what you systematically withhold, there’s just nothing that could be done :(” Does your family own a restaurant or something?
What part of “I haven’t frequented tipped restaurants in 20 years” did you not understand? Obviously I have an opinion on tipping, how are you having trouble understanding that I would voice it in a public forum when that is the topic? You made a shitty point and I commented on it, why would not going to tipped restaurants keep me from doing that, exactly? Your logic is fucked up all around.
Bullshit, and that’s a dangerously naive perspective. If everyone stopped tipping tomorrow, the only people that would be hurting are the people who serve.
All labor regulations exist because there will always be someone desperate enough to do anything for a paycheck. Child laborers. Prostututes. Dallas Cowboys. People will do anything for money, and the only way to prevent exploitation is with regulation. The “free market” will turn your bones into paste before it provides a living wage to laborers.
Capitalism is an unbalanced power dynamic that relies on an excess of desperation. If people didn’t need to sell their time, they’d never sell it for less than it is worth to employers. So if everyone agreed to just stop tipping, service would get much worse, and servers would be working for $2.10 an hour plus kitchen scraps.
Why do people insist that you get paid 2.10/hr? That’s 2.10/hr + Tips IF AND ONLY IF that wage equals more than minimum wage. That’s how it’s always been.
If minimum wage is 7.25 (in a lot of states, it still is), then they are paid 7.25x40 OR 2.10x40+tips, whichever of those two numbers is higher. They CANNOT LEGALLY PAY YOU less than minimum wage.
So when people say “If you stopped tipping today, all that would be hurt is the tipped workers” I’m less inclined to believe them if they also parrot absolutely false information without a second thought.
But I do agree with you, tipped wage jobs suck, and the tips seem to be the only benefit. So, let’s ensure they get a proper wage from their employer, stop tipping, and if service sucks until things are figured out, I guess I’m eating at home or eating shitty-service burgers because I’d rather the system get un-fucked than continue to engage in that system.
The single best thing people can do to end tipping culture is to just stop tipping.
Vote for social safety nets or make donations to care for those who will be harmed by this.
But right now it’s people like you that are perpetuating tipping culture.
And yes, I am an asshole - but it’s not solely because of my stance on tipping.
Nah, it’s a known cultural fact that tipped wages are offloaded directly onto the consumer. Not paying them is refusing to participate in the game of capitalism in the worst possible way. By withholding the wages of your fellow worker but continuing to do business with their employer, you are just increasing the value extracted from them.
If you don’t want to tip, don’t go to tipped restaurants.
That’s it. That’s the only ethical play to avoid tipping. Don’t participate at all, don’t fund the unethical business model at all. As it stands, not tipping doesn’t threaten the business model - they still get paid.
Lol, I’m sure your reasoning is really going to make a difference to the person depending on tips to make rent. And I’m sure the owner is just going to feel terrible that his server didn’t get compensated.
Maybe you should just avoid giving your business to restaurants that exploit the tip based system? You aren’t ending tipping culture by not tipping, you’re just taking advantage of workers just as much as the owners.
If a person doesn’t tip, their server doesn’t get tipped.
If that same person avoids giving business to restaurants that exploit the tip based system, the same server still doesn’t get tipped.
You’re not ending tipping culture by tipping, either. Just saying.
They may have more time or availability for someone who does tip, plus they aren’t wasting their labour on someone.
Yeah, but I never claimed I was attempting to end tipping culture by wasting people’s time and effort.
Again, why not just support businesses that don’t rely on tipping to pay their staff?
Oh, wow. Suddenly they’re not being paid at all only because one person doesn’t tip? How does that work?
Not tipping wastes nobody’s time. That’s not how time works. You did say “You aren’t ending tipping culture by not tipping, you’re just taking advantage of workers just as much as the owners” which I turned around on you, though. Also, what you said here is wrong because I don’t exploit anybody’s labour by not tipping since I’m not getting paid to eat out. You understand that.
Why didn’t I think of that and not do it for the last 20 years? You really opened my eyes to the most obvious thing ever! I already don’t perpetuate a system that exploits workers. Maybe you should too.
Lol, I’m guessing you’ve never worked in a restaurant before? If you are taking one of their tables and they are having to serve you, and you don’t tip…they don’t get money for that table and whatever time you used it for. If you hadn’t taken up the table, they may have gotten a customer who wasn’t an asshole.
It wastes the servers time, but you don’t seem to think that matters.
How, by being wrong?
Tipping is wrong because it turns over the responsibility of labour expense to the customer. You, the customer are denying that labour expense and leaving the labourer unpaid for their labour. Meaning you are participating and taking advantage of their labour.
Lol, you are still participating in the tip culture if you give your business to places that rely on tipping, but don’t tip. The owner still gets paid and doesn’t give a shit if the server does or not.
And if you are saying you don’t go to places that accept tips, then why are you even fucking talking to me? My whole point was that people who don’t like tipping culture shouldn’t go to places that accept tips.
I know how tipping works, thank you. If I’m not being tipped for waiting a table, I still get paid hourly wages, meaning I get money for that table or any other I wait during my work hours. If I hadn’t taken that table, I would still make hourly wages. I can’t believe you don’t know that. You’re not just acting obtuse, are you?
Not tipping wastes nobody’s time. Servers are paid by the hour. Hours are time. Servers do not get to leave earlier when they receive tips. Do you think restaurant owners waste servers’ time by underpaying them? Be honest.
You know what turning something around on someone means. If you’re unsure what happened, please make use of the scrolling up technology and use your eyes and brain to read what it says there. You already agreed that tipping doesn’t end tipping culture, so your act doesn’t really make sense now.
I don’t employ servers, so it is in no way my responsibility to pay their wages. I’m responsible for paying for the food and service that I receive. The owner is responsible to pay for the labour they receive. Rather simple in concept, really. It’s fine if you’re OK with picking up someone’s employer’s tab, I won’t. Just don’t confuse who’s exploiting who just because you so desperately want to shift the blame away from the restaurant owner. Why are you even doing that? You’re in a situation where one guy says “hey, you’re going to work for me full time but I’m only paying you a fraction even though I receive the full labour. If you’re lucky, my customers donate some of their money to your living expenses. Most do, the others are huge assholes, right?” and you go “right, that’s very fair and sensible. Thank you so much for this opportunity, Mr Moneybags! Oh, the system surely sucks but apart from shaming customers into shelling out for what you systematically withhold, there’s just nothing that could be done :(” Does your family own a restaurant or something?
What part of “I haven’t frequented tipped restaurants in 20 years” did you not understand? Obviously I have an opinion on tipping, how are you having trouble understanding that I would voice it in a public forum when that is the topic? You made a shitty point and I commented on it, why would not going to tipped restaurants keep me from doing that, exactly? Your logic is fucked up all around.
Bullshit, and that’s a dangerously naive perspective. If everyone stopped tipping tomorrow, the only people that would be hurting are the people who serve.
All labor regulations exist because there will always be someone desperate enough to do anything for a paycheck. Child laborers. Prostututes. Dallas Cowboys. People will do anything for money, and the only way to prevent exploitation is with regulation. The “free market” will turn your bones into paste before it provides a living wage to laborers.
Capitalism is an unbalanced power dynamic that relies on an excess of desperation. If people didn’t need to sell their time, they’d never sell it for less than it is worth to employers. So if everyone agreed to just stop tipping, service would get much worse, and servers would be working for $2.10 an hour plus kitchen scraps.
At least we agree on uour last point.
Who would then not want to work in those places that depends entirely of tipping. And then it hurts the owners of those places.
How are you unable to realise this? It is all connected.
That’s literally the rest of the comment. Did you just stop reading there?
That’s not. How. Tipped. Wages. Work.
Why do people insist that you get paid 2.10/hr? That’s 2.10/hr + Tips IF AND ONLY IF that wage equals more than minimum wage. That’s how it’s always been.
If minimum wage is 7.25 (in a lot of states, it still is), then they are paid 7.25x40 OR 2.10x40+tips, whichever of those two numbers is higher. They CANNOT LEGALLY PAY YOU less than minimum wage.
So when people say “If you stopped tipping today, all that would be hurt is the tipped workers” I’m less inclined to believe them if they also parrot absolutely false information without a second thought.
But I do agree with you, tipped wage jobs suck, and the tips seem to be the only benefit. So, let’s ensure they get a proper wage from their employer, stop tipping, and if service sucks until things are figured out, I guess I’m eating at home or eating shitty-service burgers because I’d rather the system get un-fucked than continue to engage in that system.
You’ve never worked a tipped job, have you? Estimate the percentage of employers who pay minimum wage if tips are too low. Throw out any number.
“You’ve never worked a tipped job have you?”
Proceeds to describe an illegal situation
Wow, you’ve never worked a job before, huh?