Imagine your search terms, key-strokes, private chats and photographs are being monitored every time they are sent. Millions of students across the country don’t have to imagine this deep surveillance of their most private communications: it’s a reality that comes with their school districts’...
…on students’ school-issued machines and accounts.
These are school issued machines, and like all machines issued by a 3rd party for use under their supervision, they come with monitoring software.
This isn’t some dystopian issue, and frankly, students should not be using school issued machines for private chats or photo storage, and should absolutely have their search history monitored while using said devices.
These aren’t necessarily the computers you and I grew up on where they had a dedicated computer lab room for use during class time. These are devices they take everywhere with them, even home. Now imagine some creepy school IT administrator decided to peek on the Webcams of kids while they’re on their room?
I honestly don’t know if they do or don’t have. I’d imagine it also varies by region. I just know schools have started giving out laptops to kids to take home if they are needed.
There are more people in poverty without a computer than you realize. Now write me a 5 paragraph essay with correct source citation on your smart phone.
Many of the kids affected have no access to another device. The whole reason schools supply hardware now is because it’s needed to access their educational materials, and it’s massively inequitable to only have students who have money able to develop their skills at home.
This isn’t isolated to school-issued equipment. While this article is mostly talking about high school students, this same situation plagues upper education, as well. My roommate was recently taking some college courses from home, and the proctoring software they require installs rootkit-level spyware on his computer and tried monitoring our entire network activity.
The difference between schools installing the programs on their own hardware and installing them on personal devices is stark and I cannot take any argument seriously that ignores this.
Either way, the use of this invasive software is required in order to attend public school.
Oh? Who is forcing the use of school issued equipment?
Last time I checked one did not need a school issued device to attend a public school. In fact I would go out on a limb and say the majority are too underfunded to give every student a device in the first place.
Oh? Who is forcing the use of school issued equipment?
The schools. Many assignments are given 100% digitally now, with no option for a pencil-and-paper version outside of special needs situations, which not every student qualifies for.
Last time I checked
“was clearly a long time ago” is how that sentence should’ve ended.
My answer: These are school issued machines, and like all machines issued by a 3rd party for use under their supervision, they come with monitoring software.
It is acceptable because it is the schools property and they can do as they wish with it. Everyone else is free to not use those machines.
This is not a hard thing to grasp.
But since you are just being combative we are done here.
Cowardly slinking away into the shadows is par for the course.
Offer a real conversation to others instead of being combative and maybe you will have better results with people in the future.
The whole pro company schtick is getting old.
I never once stated I was “pro company”. Another tip, free of charge, don’t put words in peoples mouths. Makes your already faulty argument moot.
Is everyone free not to use them?
Yes.
Can people afford to make another choice while at the same time being forced to use laptops?
No one is forced to use a laptop. Libraries exist with free internet access and computer.
Is the type of monitoring reasonable and proportional?
Yes. If you do not think it is I can only assume you weren’t a child when the internet became a thing. I was “monitored” on school computers in the 90’s and this is no different.
Now are you actually going to participate in good faith or should I simply block you?
School is the counterparty and a state actor with everything that entails sign a poorly negotiated, likely corruption ridden contract with some trust me bro we don’t sell data, vendor, ie third party.
Now your child is subject to a contract arrangement that you are not privy too that enables some “dudes” to track your child’s usage of equipment.
If you don’t see this as an overeach, society has really degraded esp in context of the child abuse issues we are coming grips with.
School is the counterparty and a state actor with everything that entails sign a poorly negotiated, likely corruption ridden contract with some trust me bro we don’t sell data, vendor, ie third party.
What could be gained by monitoring someones school activity that is not already bought and sold by social media companies that the majority use excessively and daily?
Now your child is subject to a contract arrangement that you are not privy too that enables some “dudes” to track your child’s usage of equipment.
Don’t use third party hardware if you are worried about being monitored.
If you don’t see this as an overeach, society has really degraded esp in context of the child abuse issues we are coming grips with.
If you could make a real argument that isn’t a personal attack or logical fallacy that would be great.
Yeah, when i was in school; there were no devices issued to students. We had ‘computer labs’. Ie; a room full of computers for student use. There was always one computer for the teachers to use that had a remote-desktop interface monitoring every screen in the room live. They could always see what you were doing, lockout your keyboard/mouse, blank your display.
This really doesn’t seem any different.
I could understand outrage if students were require to install this on their own hardware; but school issued devices are under the schools monitoring and control. Always have been.
I feel like that is the bigger problem. These aren’t private/personal devices; students shouldn’t be treating them as personal devices. Especially knowing it’s a monitored device.
Properly educating students on the use of these devices is the solution. Not telling schools to turn a blind eye to the use of their own equipment.
These are fucking kids. They are still learning what devices do and what their appropriate use is. If they are like me, they have probably already found ways to watch porn, monitor their crush’s computer, read their email, and get into their webcam.
If they are like me, they have probably already found ways to watch porn, monitor their crush’s computer, read their email, and get into their webcam.
I got into quite a bit of similar mischief as a (pre)teen; but I didn’t do any of it on equipment that I knew was monitored (at least, monitored and signed out to me…)
I mean yeah, I don’t watch porn on an office computer at work after all. They should have their own devices for all that stuff. School devices = school-related activity only, no more.
And again; I think that’s a bit of a separate issue. These devices shouldn’t be equipped with cameras, let alone have the camera monitored/accessible.
The actual activity happening on the device; running applications, what’s on screen/in storage, even it’s location (with informed notice of said tracking) sure. but there’s no need to monitor/access the camera regardless of how or where the device is used.
A simple piece of tape fixes this problem. (plus education to teach students why, ofc)
When doing zoom calls for work I do it behind a curtain. Nobody sees my home at all. Then I cover the cam when not in use. These are just common sense privacy measures we should be teaching them anyway.
I agree that this is no different, and has the same solution: Don’t use the schools computers for things that aren’t for school and you won’t have no problems.
These are school issued machines, and like all machines issued by a 3rd party for use under their supervision, they come with monitoring software.
This isn’t some dystopian issue, and frankly, students should not be using school issued machines for private chats or photo storage, and should absolutely have their search history monitored while using said devices.
These aren’t necessarily the computers you and I grew up on where they had a dedicated computer lab room for use during class time. These are devices they take everywhere with them, even home. Now imagine some creepy school IT administrator decided to peek on the Webcams of kids while they’re on their room?
No need to imagine, it’s linked in the article: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/610k-settlement-in-school-webcam-spy-case/
God the school’s response is so sleazy and unapologetic
that’s how they act when they get caught, remember the Catholic Church
Camera/mic access seems like overreach. PII should be obfuscated and only accessible with an audited workflow that includes an access review.
Modern off the shelf MDM is capable of this.
wait schools dont have computer labs anymore??? in ALL my schools and the one im in right now we have them
I honestly don’t know if they do or don’t have. I’d imagine it also varies by region. I just know schools have started giving out laptops to kids to take home if they are needed.
I understand the difference between a laptop and PC thanks.
Now imagine if, and hear me out, one didn’t bring school hardware home so some “creepy IT administrator” doesn’t have access.
“Save the kids” arguments always fall flat on the face when the solution is as simple as leaving school devices at school.
They have to take it home for homework.
No, they don’t. I am sure the majority have a computer or smart phone at home, and if not libraries exist for a reason.
There are more people in poverty without a computer than you realize. Now write me a 5 paragraph essay with correct source citation on your smart phone.
Yeah it’s a good thing homework doesn’t exist.
Good thing for home computers, smart devices, and libraries eh?
Good thing nobody is poor!
Good thing poor people have access to public libraries. I know from experience.
There are “book deserts” where it can be difficult to visit a public library.
There are plenty of articles showing how libraries across the country are closing, usually in poor neighborhoods.
Sounds like a bigger problem than schools monitoring the use of devices issued to children.
Might want to get that sorted.
Many of the kids affected have no access to another device. The whole reason schools supply hardware now is because it’s needed to access their educational materials, and it’s massively inequitable to only have students who have money able to develop their skills at home.
This isn’t isolated to school-issued equipment. While this article is mostly talking about high school students, this same situation plagues upper education, as well. My roommate was recently taking some college courses from home, and the proctoring software they require installs rootkit-level spyware on his computer and tried monitoring our entire network activity.
I’ve had to use that horrible software in university. I asked for accommodations because I use Linux and they issued me a university laptop for exams.
I would schedule it at the school testing center and take it there just to avoid it.
That is 100% a different issue.
Not really, though. In both scenarios, somebody attending a public school is required to have invasive spyware running on their devices.
The difference between schools installing the programs on their own hardware and installing them on personal devices is stark and I cannot take any argument seriously that ignores this.
You’re missing the point. Either way, the use of this invasive software is required in order to attend public school.
I cannot take any argument seriously that ignores this.
Oh? Who is forcing the use of school issued equipment?
Last time I checked one did not need a school issued device to attend a public school. In fact I would go out on a limb and say the majority are too underfunded to give every student a device in the first place.
The schools. Many assignments are given 100% digitally now, with no option for a pencil-and-paper version outside of special needs situations, which not every student qualifies for.
“was clearly a long time ago” is how that sentence should’ve ended.
Source something that proves a single thing you have said or jog on.
Removed by mod
I’ve never heard that phrase. What does it mean?
The article has a pretty convincing argument against it. You should read the whole thing.
I read the article and it is not in any way convincing.
Sorry to burst your bubble.
Why? Can you elaborate on why this is not an issue and kids should be monitored by a 3rd party?
I already made that clear in my original comment.
No you did not. You just stated that this was the case. I’m asking why that is/should be acceptable.
Why is it normal to put monitoring software on?
Why does a 3rd party need to monitor it?
What are they monitoring that would be considered acceptable?
I honestly ask, because I can’t think of any reason.
Or is this similar to “mass shootings are a fact of life”?
Clear as day. Glad we cleared this up.
Troll… that is not an explanation on why.
Yes it is an explanation why.
Your question: Why is/should this be acceptable.
My answer: These are school issued machines, and like all machines issued by a 3rd party for use under their supervision, they come with monitoring software.
It is acceptable because it is the schools property and they can do as they wish with it. Everyone else is free to not use those machines.
This is not a hard thing to grasp.
But since you are just being combative we are done here.
That is not an explanation on why this is the case. Cowardly slinking away into the shadows is par for the course.
Just for thought:
I’ll bet a dollar the answer to this all is NO.
The whole pro company schtick is getting old.
Offer a real conversation to others instead of being combative and maybe you will have better results with people in the future.
I never once stated I was “pro company”. Another tip, free of charge, don’t put words in peoples mouths. Makes your already faulty argument moot.
Yes.
No one is forced to use a laptop. Libraries exist with free internet access and computer.
Yes. If you do not think it is I can only assume you weren’t a child when the internet became a thing. I was “monitored” on school computers in the 90’s and this is no different.
Now are you actually going to participate in good faith or should I simply block you?
Removed by mod
Justify it however you want it but this is a huge over reach esp since we got some shiti 3p vendor involved to middle man this.
I totally trust them not to sell that data after it is “properly anonymized” or “leaked” 🤡
Can you explain to me how a 3rd party putting monitoring software on their own hardware is an over reach?
School is the counterparty and a state actor with everything that entails sign a poorly negotiated, likely corruption ridden contract with some trust me bro we don’t sell data, vendor, ie third party.
Now your child is subject to a contract arrangement that you are not privy too that enables some “dudes” to track your child’s usage of equipment.
If you don’t see this as an overeach, society has really degraded esp in context of the child abuse issues we are coming grips with.
What could be gained by monitoring someones school activity that is not already bought and sold by social media companies that the majority use excessively and daily?
Don’t use third party hardware if you are worried about being monitored.
If you could make a real argument that isn’t a personal attack or logical fallacy that would be great.
Removed by mod
Damn right.
Yeah, when i was in school; there were no devices issued to students. We had ‘computer labs’. Ie; a room full of computers for student use. There was always one computer for the teachers to use that had a remote-desktop interface monitoring every screen in the room live. They could always see what you were doing, lockout your keyboard/mouse, blank your display.
This really doesn’t seem any different.
I could understand outrage if students were require to install this on their own hardware; but school issued devices are under the schools monitoring and control. Always have been.
These are different because kids take these computers home, and it’s some random working for a 3rd party monitoring what’s going on.
Creepy.
I feel like that is the bigger problem. These aren’t private/personal devices; students shouldn’t be treating them as personal devices. Especially knowing it’s a monitored device.
Properly educating students on the use of these devices is the solution. Not telling schools to turn a blind eye to the use of their own equipment.
These are fucking kids. They are still learning what devices do and what their appropriate use is. If they are like me, they have probably already found ways to watch porn, monitor their crush’s computer, read their email, and get into their webcam.
It’s not lack of education.
It’s lack of impulse control.
I got into quite a bit of similar mischief as a (pre)teen; but I didn’t do any of it on equipment that I knew was monitored (at least, monitored and signed out to me…)
Then you were the exception.
I mean yeah, I don’t watch porn on an office computer at work after all. They should have their own devices for all that stuff. School devices = school-related activity only, no more.
Like doing homework in your room? Where now the monitor can turn on your webcam without you knowing and watch you in your personal space?
And again; I think that’s a bit of a separate issue. These devices shouldn’t be equipped with cameras, let alone have the camera monitored/accessible.
The actual activity happening on the device; running applications, what’s on screen/in storage, even it’s location (with informed notice of said tracking) sure. but there’s no need to monitor/access the camera regardless of how or where the device is used.
A simple piece of tape fixes this problem. (plus education to teach students why, ofc)
When doing zoom calls for work I do it behind a curtain. Nobody sees my home at all. Then I cover the cam when not in use. These are just common sense privacy measures we should be teaching them anyway.
tape on the computer camera? my family’s done that for years on all/most of our devices lmao
Even if kid limits it to that, this arrangement is still no appropriate.
I agree that this is no different, and has the same solution: Don’t use the schools computers for things that aren’t for school and you won’t have no problems.